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Comment Archives: stories: News & Opinion: The Range: The Tucson Weekly's Daily Dispatch

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

Article 5

Imagine if all voters were required to have the same minimal understanding of US government that is required of all new citizens. How many could name event the three branches of government? Describe how a bill becomes a law? Most of us learned this in junior high school. The president elect seems a bit confused with both of these basic tenets so it might be expecting too much of the average citizen. "An informed citizenry?" Right.

8 likes, 5 dislikes
Posted by Rick Spanier on 11/21/2016 at 11:20 AM

Re: “Education In a Trump Presidency: Reading Tea Leaves

It would seem from what you write here, David, that you are concerned about racial justice and the plight of low-SES citizens who are underserved by our public district schools.

So where has your commentary been on TUSD's failures to implement its deseg order?

(You want to run down attempts to give families alternatives to enrolling their children in schools like TUSD's Utterback, but you have provided no commentary on the district's inability or unwillingness to use the desegregation funds allocated to it to fill positions like "Family Liaison" and "Dance Teacher" in a troubled "Fine Arts" magnet that can't achieve the diversity goals stipulated because it can't deliver on the promises made by its "magnet status (e.g. actually having Fine Arts faculty in place to educate students). And you endorsed a candidate for the Board of our largest local public school district who has been conspicuous and persistent in her efforts in office to disregard or disparage the people trying to hold the district accountable for doing what is necessary to implement plans made with community participation and Board approval that would, if followed, have some chance of integrating the schools and delivering better services to underserved populations.)

When will you and others who exhaust themselves arguing against charters and vouchers understand that arguments like those you perpetually make only have the potential for validity when the effort is being made to ensure that public district schools are not, in their on-the-ground, in-practice-as-well-as-in-theory reality, institutions that parents who pay attention to conditions in the schools and have their children's best interests at heart must choose to exit?

You can't (or shouldn't) say "On the policy level, we must allow no alternatives!" at the same time you refuse to do anything at all to advocate for improving conditions in a poorly managed public district that underserves tens of thousands of students and that, for good reason, thousands of constituents have chosen to leave during the past decade. (And in case you are inclined to reach for another of your knee-jerk, unthinking canned arguments that pay no attention whatsoever either to the REALITY of conditions in the schools or to the endemic behaviors in some poor urban districts' administrations, please note that asking for people who chronically mis-apply funds to receive more funding is in no way a solution to the problems students experience in districts like TUSD.)

10 likes, 4 dislikes
Posted by Your advocacy for improving public district schools is MIA. on 11/21/2016 at 10:17 AM

Re: “Education In a Trump Presidency: Reading Tea Leaves

Speaking of failing schools did anybody see the interview with the TUSD parent who, after begging TUSD to discipline students to stop bullying her son, received a call from school security telling her she can never step foot on a TUSD campus or admin building again. Ever in her life. They have accused her of interfering in education.

Funny, that's what I have accused TUSD of.

11 likes, 6 dislikes
Posted by Concerned Mom on 11/21/2016 at 10:00 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

hahaha these kids don't know crap neither does majority of America. Why don't you teach them the REAL enemy. While everybody is worried about who's president they have totally forgot our government structure. Legislation runs this country. Congress having unlimited terms. Where congress get influenced by lobbyists by money, stocks and campaign funds. So our country is a giant faade. Congress makes choices based off of how much money they can make and not for what's best for America. EVERY congressional member is corrupt and it can be proven in public records.
You want real change? You need to study the constitution.
Article 5.
method of proposing Amendments can be done when two-thirds of all State
legislatures request that Congress convene a special Constitutional Convention
that will be made up of delegates that will propose Amendments. In both
cases, any proposed Amendments will then be sent on to the State
legislatures for ratification.
Means it can be ratified without congressional approval to impose term limits on congress at a state level.
Get that in your thick skulls. For the last 30 years they have ruined our country not the presidents.

5 likes, 3 dislikes
Posted by Article 5 of the Constitution on 11/21/2016 at 9:16 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

CW13 - Bslap must have been talking about Obama's war, the "right" war, the 'good war'. 7 years ago he announced the massive build up of 30,000 more troops to Afghanistan. Dec. 1, 2009.

"President Obama announced his new strategy in Afghanistan and Pakistan in a speech Tuesday night, vowing to deploy 30,000 additional troops to Afghanistan as quickly as possible and setting July 2011 as a date to begin pulling U.S. forces out of the country."

"This was the night when Barack Obama took full ownership of the war in Afghanistan," he (Bob Seifert) said.

5 likes, 17 dislikes
Posted by What, Again on 11/21/2016 at 9:10 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

Bslap. I think you have that backwards.

5 likes, 13 dislikes
Posted by CW13 on 11/21/2016 at 8:41 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?


Perhaps, just perhaps, the election of so many Republicans across America will be the beginning of the end of the strangle-hold unions have on education. If so, a much brighter future will greet the youth of America and do much to "to make America great again;" to barrow Donnie's campaign slogan.

6 likes, 21 dislikes
Posted by Bisbee boy on 11/21/2016 at 8:01 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

Silly Safier, Americans don't remember anything that happened 7 years ago. How do you think the Republicans got back into the White House?
Time to crank up the war machine back and run the economy into the ditch. Then they'll spend another 8 years viciously attacking whatever Democrat gets elected to clean up the mess.

12 likes, 6 dislikes
Posted by bslap on 11/21/2016 at 7:20 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

You forget, Betts, that Safier, like other Democratic Party tools, doesn't bother to watch Board meetings in which the behavior of the elected officials he sees fit to endorse can be observed. Nor does he bother to spend time on the sites in the district, seeing the direct effect negligent governance and bad administration has on teachers and students in the schools (and making himself aware of cases of top-down retaliation, where they happen). He takes orders from the powers that determine which candidates are sufficiently compliant and submissive, and he goes to work promoting them or, (if they are in office) excusing their behavior and failing to report relevant information to voters.

He may toss a worthy candidate who is independent of the insider-controlled machine a bone here and there, but if he does so it will be in language that makes clear what a concession he is making to deign to endorse someone who has shown herself to be insufficiently pragmatic (read: compliant).

So much for Safier, and so much for voters and citizens both locally and nationally, who have not exercised the due diligence or invested the effort necessary at the grass roots organizing level to ensure that our mainline political parties will not repeatedly put forward and promote, at the expense of better candidates, morally compromised individuals unfit to lead.

One can hope that the results of the 2016 elections will be a wake up call both locally and nationally, but to hope that might be naive, in light of what has been observed. Those who've been paying attention have been receiving wake up calls for some years now, but no matter how loud the alarm is sounded, we seem to have arrived at a place where the majority of voters will either not hear the call, or will respond in a way that seems unlikely to arrive improve their situations.

(FYI, Safier, in case you were unaware: the results of the 2016 Pima County elections are scheduled to be certified by the Pima County Board of Supervisors today. At last count, Stegeman and your friend Kristel Foster had regained their seats and results for the third and last available seat were as follows: Sedgwick 50,205, Putnam-Hidalgo 49,519)

15 likes, 4 dislikes
Posted by The machine endorses bullying and dysfunction. on 11/21/2016 at 6:52 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

BPH - instead of the cowardly throwing out "hate filled comments", point exactly to a comment that is hate filled, not truth based. Oops - you forgot to throw in 'racist'. You're slipping.

Bully-In-Chief - the one who says you bring a knife to the political fight? The one who says you punish your enemies? The one that said his own white grandmother had reactions bred into her? The one that says he has a pen, didn't need a congress, the American people?

7 likes, 17 dislikes
Posted by What, Again on 11/21/2016 at 6:06 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

That the American people didn't want the tag team of sexual predators, Bill Clinton and Anthony Weiner, in the white house preying on staffers' daughters and interns.

6 likes, 24 dislikes
Posted by What, Again on 11/21/2016 at 6:00 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

The usual suspects vent their hate filled comments and no one (hardly) touches on the best point raised by the article which is: when you have a Bully-In-Chief, how do you teach kids not to bully? The election has just made hypocrites out of every teacher who says that one can't get ahead through bullying, being egotistical or mean-spirited. And I won't even relate that to the TUSD election, after audiences have watched a local version of this play out twice a month in the Board room. Oh, and don't forget retaliation, thats a presidential (and superintendential) characteristic that is a little hard to teach around as well.

21 likes, 6 dislikes
Posted by Betts Putnam-Hidalgo on 11/21/2016 at 5:27 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

That very few liked Hillary. She's a liar, she's mean, has an insatiable thirst for power and screeches.

5 likes, 22 dislikes
Posted by What, Again on 11/20/2016 at 7:11 PM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

No teacher with professional integrity uses a captive audience of schoolchildren to broadcast their political opinions. If you want to brainwash people, go join a cult. Otherwise, have a modicum of respect for the students in your classroom and teach subject content as you are being paid to do.

10 likes, 4 dislikes
Posted by Sten Nides on 11/20/2016 at 3:45 PM

Re: “Getting Real: Breaking Into Reality TV

The word "star" and the word "reality" should not be used in the same paragraph.

1 like, 0 dislikes
Posted by Gandalf the White on 11/20/2016 at 1:27 PM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

To the parents who illegally brought their children into our country, shame on you for the predicament you have put them in because you wouldn't obey our laws. And to the politicians that lured them here for the government money that follows them, the Grijalva mob and their white guilt liberal lemmings, double shame on you for exploiting these children . Look at the mess you have created.

10 likes, 26 dislikes
Posted by What, Again on 11/20/2016 at 1:05 PM

Re: “Keep Your Pup Safe: Understanding Parvo and Distemper

We like Paws Pet Clinic on River road and particularly the owner Randy and his wife Geren who are both great vets. It's a long way to go for you but I think it's worth it. Robert Mackay

1 like, 0 dislikes
Posted by Annie Robert MacKay on 11/20/2016 at 12:49 PM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

When teachers stray from teaching facts to opinion they enter the non-education realm of indoctrination. The only fact we have at this time is that Donald Trump was elected President of the United States on November 8, 2016 with a clear majority of the only body that counts in our election, the Electoral College. Enough Americans under the current process voted in sufficient numbers to place him in a position to be elected.

So here's a lesson that can be taught at the appropriate grade level: What is the Electoral College, Why is this means we use to elect presidents, and for discussion Should we consider doing away with it and use the popular vote to select our president?

Many of us are dismayed by Trump's election. Many of us would have been equally dismayed by the election of Hillary Clinton. Many of us are dismayed that as Ochsian Liberals ("Love me, I'm a liberal) and Progressives our votes don't matter in the State of Arizona just as many of our conservative friends are dismayed that their votes don't matter here in the Baked Pueblo.

So here's another lesson to be taught at the appropriate grade level: How are congressional districts drawn up? Why are the outlines of the districts so weird? If the popular opinion of Congress is so low, why do the same members of congress and senators keep being elected?

See? No weeping and gnashing off teeth. No barely contained fits of rage. No whining and cries of victimization. Discussion of elections and politics can be held without jumping off the cliff of confusing education with indoctrination.

16 likes, 5 dislikes
Posted by Rick Spanier on 11/20/2016 at 8:12 AM

Re: “Update! Vince Neil to play Donald Trump's Induction. Of Course He is. True Bros in Arms.

pretty sure motley crue weren't political in the slightest
dicks, yes but apolitical

3 likes, 3 dislikes
Posted by big digger on 11/20/2016 at 6:48 AM

Re: “What Will We Tell the School Children?

You shouldn't have to "tell" the school children anything -- they should be able to read, write and use critical thinking skills themselves to figure out what is going on in the world around them; Oh wait, we're in Arizona where education, especially the education of future voters, has a lower priority than releasing unsuspecting Mountain Goats into the same mountains where they just released hungry Mountain Lions. So I guess we just hand them a piece of paper with an outline of the state and a red crayon and tell them to color it in without going outside the lines.

18 likes, 10 dislikes
Posted by sgsmith on 11/20/2016 at 1:34 AM

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