Correct me if I’m wrong here, but I don’t remember “Raising Taxes” being one of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. War, Famine, Pestilence and Death are more traditionally mentioned. But an AZ Capitol Times article warns in its headline, K-12 funding suit could bring fiscal doomsday scenario. So, maybe the prospect of raising taxes in Arizona to pay the state’s bills really is that dire.
The topic is the deadbeat dads and moms Republican legislators who just don’t want to pay the child support education funding they owe, by law. It’s $337 million a year, plus $1.3 billion to make up for their short-changing our children since 2009. Admittedly, they have a legitimate problem right now. The state is having a hell of a time figuring out how to cover its current shortfall even if it doesn’t make its legally mandated education payment. And Governor Ducey ran on a No New Taxes Cut Taxes Even More pledge. What’s a conservative gonna do?
Ducey wants the legislature to make a deal with the plaintiffs who are demanding the full $337 million, hoping the lege can get away with paying pennies on the dollar. At this point, the plaintiffs aren’t interested, though that may change. But Republican Rep. David Livingston doesn’t like the idea of compromise. He says the Republican legislators should just refuse to pay up.
“The real question is does a court system want to have a constitutional battle over this? They can tell us we are required to pay that. But I don’t believe legally they can force us to do that.”
Don Peters, the lawyer representing the school districts, doesn’t agree.
The courts have ways of enforcing such decisions, [Peters] said, including holding state officials in contempt, imposing fines or even putting parts of state government into receivership. He said he doubted that the Legislature would actually take such an action.
There’s an easy, or at least an obvious, solution. Raise taxes. Tim Steller made the case for a tax hike in a recent column in The Star, showing the state budget is at the lowest percentage of state residents’ income it’s been in 35 years. Raise that percentage a bit by getting rid of some of the more ridiculous tax exemptions and raising the income tax rate on those who can best afford it—yes, tax the rich, who are doing very well in these days of growing income inequality—and the state can pay its bills, with maybe a little left over to, say, fix a pothole or two.
But Republicans won’t have it—or not enough of them, anyway. If it only took a simple majority to raise taxes, it’s possible that a few renegade Republicans could join with Democrats and pass a tax hike. But in Arizona, it takes a two-thirds majority in the legislature to pass a tax increase, meaning that one-third-plus-one representatives or senators can block any tax bill that comes their way. Arizona voters passed the supermajority referendum a few decades ago. If we want the state to regain its fiscal sanity, voters need to pass a new referendum to get rid of it. Then getting legislators to pass a tax hike would be only very difficult, not impossible.
This article appears in Jan 29 – Feb 4, 2015.
Oh, if only we could increase taxes on others with a simple majority. The communist utopia is so close. All we have to do is continue demonizing the successful. The dependent, the lazy, the liberals could inherit the vast fortunes illegally swindled from the masses by the evil white American male and we could enslave them to our benefit forever.
They have been irresponsible with money given to them in the past. The best way to break an addiction is to admit you have a problem and then quit, cold turkey. Raising taxes does nothing but encourage more waste and bad behavior.
Fix the problem and then you can have a cookie. The Postal Service is actually doing just that. Take a lesson.
David Seifer – guess what – there was an election – you and you’re fellow liberal marxists – well, you LOST. BIG TIME!
Elections have consequences. It’s a representative democracy. Deal with it. And maybe get out of Tucson a bit more, recognize this place as the far, far leftist dying town it has become.
Ah, if only Republicans said “Elections have consequences” back in 2008. It would have been smooth sailing for Obama and the Democrats. (I can dream, can’t I?)
Well, you are wrong there, David Safier. Maybe you forgot, the Dems, led by Obama, had it all in 2008. The American people got Obamacare forced on them. Following that, dems got their butt kicked in the house and lost.
It’s tough to rule against the will of the people. But liberals can’t learn, their commitment to communism overrides all.
I seem to remember a certain segment of the population crying “illegals, illegals, they need to be dealt with, it’s the law…”
Now that same segment is saying “forget the law, we aren’t paying…”
Of course we should expect those working, living, and trying to pay Pima County and Tucson property taxes in the 7th poorest city in America to pay more taxes to educate illegals.
I cannot understand why so many of the above comments are justifying stealing money from the education funds of our children. Every single person should be irate over what this has done to the children and education in Arizona. We are 48th in the nation in what we spend on education. Go into the schools. Look at the buildings in need of repair, the books that are old and the poor salaries teachers receive. We have so many teacher vacancies because they can do so many other things than teach in Arizona for the salaries they are offered and it is difficult work. I see above that someone said there is so much waste. Where? We need money to educate. Massachusetts used to be number 1 in education achievement and money spent(It may still be. I just haven’t looked in a while). There is a direct correlation between money spent on education and achievement. Illegals are also not the problem. Go visit our schools. I am a retired teacher who still teaches part time and I love public education. I have been in many schools in Tucson and see teachers, administrators and support staff working very hard. I feel intensely sad at the comments above and what I see is going on. We want educated children for a strong state and country. Please don’t listen to commentaries about communism. If this is an example of communism it doesn’t work very well. Do your own research. It is relatively easy and hopefully you will change your mind.
I just want to add that Senator McCain stated in 2008 ish when he was running for president that we have more charter schools than any other state in the union and he was very proud of this fact. Now I don’t know if that statement is still true but we have more now than in 2008. This model sure doesn’t seem to be working for us . Our achievement has gone slightly down( we were pretty low nationally in the first place) and we spend less on education than many other states. Now I repeat, if this is communism then why would we want to keep it this way??
David, it’s about time that someone called this as it is – we have simply lowered taxes to the point where our fiscal stability is unsustainable. Since 1992 when Fife Symington was elected as our Governor, we have lowered taxes in all but one year – ostensibly to “jump start the economy”. It hasn’t worked and yet we still hear this mantra “lower taxes, jobs will come, lower taxes, jobs will come, etc.” We sound like a zen Buddhist chanting. As we have lowered taxes and as many of our legislatures have signed pledges to an out of state special interest group (Grover Norquist) not to ever raise taxes, our education program has deteriorated to 46th in the Nation (Ed Week report) our school funding is 50th in the Nation, our roads and bridges have had years now of deferred maintenance, our ADWR is a mere shadow of itself, our child safety programs are the subject of national scorn and on and on. Oh! but we can afford more private prisons.
To the majority of the commenters above who equate a tax increase to “liberal marxists” or blame the illegals or a communist takeover or even yet another nefarious outrage by President Obama, I would simply say, there is no free lunch. It costs money to live in this country, we all need to pay our fair share.
To quote the old oil filter ad, “Pay me now or pay me later”
Keep it up, David!
I love the irony of the same nitwit right-wing trolls who say we should abolish taxes also complaining bitterly about freakin’ potholes, of all things, as if that were somehow more important than educating our children. Apparently the nitwit right-wing trolls did not receive a decent education themselves, because I learned in kindergarten that sharing is a virtue, and not long thereafter that you generally can’t get something for nothing, and not long thereafter that it is often necessary to make sacrifices for the good of the order and the well being of family and community.
Alas, these lessons were lost on some folks, and these days the right-wingers are rocking a very successful multi-billion-dollar campaign finance industry dedicated to convincing the portion of the masses who did learn these principles to join Republicans in forgetting and/or abandoning them.
Thus the growing sickness that infects our society, the mindless, craven selfishness that pervades our politics, which are fraught with fear and scapegoating. Yes, elections have consequences, especially when they’re rigged by the wealthy to serve the interests of the wealthy. You get what you pay for–isn’t that Capitalism 101?
The anti-tax pea-brains are in the same camp as the anti-vaccine screw-heads. Their patron saint, Ronnie of Hollywood, raised taxes all the time, still grinning like an idiot but cognizant of the fact that government doesn’t run on right-wing hot air. Smart businessmen know when to increase prices and ask for loans and AZ is in desperate need of operating funds AND capital right now.
Many of the pea brains don’t understand that the anti tax pea brains (in their words) are actually anti waste patriots. Some Americans don’t care whose money or how much they waste.
Overfunding pension plans and over hiring have decimated taxpayers. They have operating funds. They just chose to waste them.
Look at this publication from the Children’s Action Alliance. Corporations have been getting a free ride in AZ, while the education for children continues to suffer.
http://azchildren.org/wp-content/uploads/2…
p. 16
“Significant tax cuts include:
• Reducing the top individual income tax rate by a third
• Cutting the corporate income tax rate nearly in half (from 9 percent to 4.9 percent)
• Cutting commercial property valuation rates
• Allowing multi-state corporations to choose between different methods of calculating
taxable income to give them the lowest tax bill
• Establishing ten new tax credits and expanding three existing credits
• Reducing income taxes paid on long-term capital gains
By fiscal year 2016, the cumulative impact of this steady stream of tax cuts enacted since
1990 will reach $1.4 billion in less state revenues in just one year. These amounts are not
adjusted for inflation—if they were, the impact would be more than doubled.”
Have we gained more jobs or a better economy from 25 years of tax cutting? Absolutely not.
The Governor and legislature are playing a shell game, all the while refusing to pay the court ordered money owed to schools.
It’s time to start speaking up.
Thanks to Robin, Skinnyman, Michael, and Mark for renewing my spirit after reading those initial, misguided comments.
“Socialists and progressives are always willing to take somebody elses money, but never their own.” Start a fund. Kickstart?
There is so much involved in creating brain connectivity at early ages. Raising taxes is not involved.
Encourage all children to learn another and any language at preK to thru at least grade 5. This can be completed with many quality computer programs.
Name me one country, city, state, county, etc. that taxed itself into prosperity. Don’t feel bad. Bill Clinton couldn’t name one either.
Great reference CW13. There are numerous quotes regarding that:
“We contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.”
― Winston S. Churchill
“No nation has ever taxed itself into prosperity.”
― Rush Limbaugh
This man loved freedom:
“To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.”
― Thomas Jefferson
“The invention of the teenager was a mistake. Once you identify a period of life in which people get to stay out late but don’t have to pay taxes – naturally, no one wants to live any other way.”
― Judith Martin
Thanks. And they’re all true. I guess the 2 dislikes mean that the truth hurts.
Could you conservatives cut the comments of dead people, almost dead people and people who are alive but mentirosos and address the current circumstances?
I guess the only acceptable way to debt and spend money for the naysayers here is an illegal war killing people and making millions for armament makers and others . I pray that I never ever consider an illegal war (thus killing 1000s) more important than education for our children. I did not hear 1 Republican in my environment complain about what Bush did with the surplus CLinton left and put the war on a credit card. Now they complain about waste????
Glad to, Pima. Although he’s dead from the neck up let’s talk about Obummer and what he’s done to the country. By the way I notice you and robin still didn’t answer my origional question.
In answer to your question… I can but it is all in your definition of prosperity . No matter what anyone says… someone, like you, will find a way to justify giving the rich the breaks. THat is how most of the wealth in the world will be owned by a few people in 2016. So I say Finland . They have much higher tax rates, free schools, and healthcare. Now you probably don’t think that is prosperity …. think about this… many people go into service of some type in those countries because they do not worry about schooling and healthcare. So they do what they do what they really want to do. http://www.firstprinciplesjournal.com/arti…. Now also, instead of limiting it to one country, why don’t you read this article and get some real education regarding economics and prosperity? It is well written and extremely informative.
Mr. T, I read through your quotes, and most of them hold to your thesis, but you might read the last one more carefully:
“The invention of the teenager was a mistake. Once you identify a period of life in which people get to stay out late but don’t have to pay taxes – naturally, no one wants to live any other way.”
― Judith Martin
She called people who object to paying taxes arrested teenagers. Oops! (Actually, calling libertarians and some conservatives arrested teenagers . . . hmm, why does that make so much sense to me?)
Robin. If Finland is such a Garden Of Eden, why the Hell do you live here ?
Just wanted to see if you were still boycotting my posts. Thanks. Good catch.
Mr. T, did you really set a trap for me? If so, bravo! Truth: I read the first sentence of all your comments. If I see what I consider an ounce of sense in it, I’ll plow on. Otherwise, it’s see ya later! Here you had some quotations from famous people, and I’m a sucker for that kind of thing.
Me too. But I’m sorry, it’s Mrs T not Mr.
I just love that teenager quote. It probbly didn’t earn a spot next to Thomas Jefferson.
Unfortunately some of those teenagers are now 52 years old and still living the life.
I am in my 30’s and own a house. I do not have children and do not plan to have children. I do not want to pay more property taxes, I do not want to pay more for a Pima County or Arizona Sales Tax.
Small business and homeowners simply cannot foot the bill for additional funds into our failing education system. We cannot simply throw money at this problem to make it go away.
Do we need the police guarding the Tucson Trolley to prevent terrorism in order to milk more overtime? Do we need a police ghetto bird helicopter every time there is a suspected drunk driver? Do we need 20 cops hanging out at every holiday DUI checkpoint handing out?
How much did Tucson pay when some knucklehead cop knocked a 20 year old gear over a bench over for no reason?
Taxes are not the answer right now and I am tired of our “elected” officials spending so much money on lawsuits that are unnecessary.
Old Pueblo Independent- just some information for you. I asked my accountant if indeed our tax rates were the lowest in the nation (especially for the wealthy). He is a Republican BTW. He said pretty close… they change often but we are definitely on the low end. We do not have a failing education system… that is hype to cut more from education. We are 48th in what we spend in the nation. We are on the low end achievement-wise which went lower after all the cuts and we added more and more charter schools. We need to invest in our youth . I understand you do not have children but they are the adults of the future. THey need to be educated. Teachers in TUSD have not had a raise in years…. 37k top for bachelors with unlimited experience. Teachers were suppose to get a cost of living raise soon but the legislature is cutting so much again that it isn’t going to happen. We are buying a lot of our own supplies. We must continue to go to school. We work very hard. I contribute to many things on the little I make for other endeavors because Tucson and people matter to me. It takes money to educate… buildings, books, salaries… The legislature keeps giving the wealthier people tax cuts-(percentage is lower than for poor people), we can’t make ends meet apparently then and so they cut more from education. I can’t figure out why they are cutting from education, building private prisons and more charter schools. That is in the present budget. It is not education that is broken…. our legislature is. I trust you will do what you need to do but I wanted to give you some facts before you make a decision regarding raising taxes. BTW… investigate some of the salaries of the charter people if they disclose it. Believe me it is not the public schools that are the problem . There is money going into profit from private prisons and charter schools that could be going to improve our educational system. One more thing, the state is still heavily in debt after taking almost 1.2 billion from money the voters voted for the schools. Why are they giving money away for private prisons and more charter schools? Courts ordered them to pay it back … Ducey says he is not going to do it…. Obviously they are not managing our money well at all. Education is not the problem. Let’s get these guys out of office. The Republicans are destroying our state (and country IMHO). We are also a right to work state so contrary to what some may say, the unions have no power ….. they can’t negotiate anything in Arizona and many of the states of the union. Michigan lost unions(right to work), still in debt, opening charters, and prisons. Do you see a pattern? Michigan’s answer? Cut education also. Doesn’t work. Hasn’t worked and they keep doing it over and over. You can look my facts up. I research a lot. And if you give me some information, I gladly fact check. Contrary to what people have said here, TUSD has never committed fraud or been accused of it. People sometimes make that up. Thank you for allowing me to talk to you. I trust you will do what you need to for you. I am a retired teacher… taught in 5 states and work part time now. We are short so many teachers…. I help where I can.