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Comment Archives: stories: News & Opinion: The Range: The Tucson Weekly's Daily Dispatch

Re: “Ducey 'Next Step' Watch: Day 237—Talk Is Cheap Edition. Ducey's Funding-Lite, Destructive Education Proposals.

When I look back on my own K-12 education -- which was an excellent one delivered in a blue state that, unlike AZ for the last couple of decades, BOTH funded AND oversaw public education responsibly -- much of the content I learned, including physics, chemistry, trig and calc, was interesting but not needed in later life. It's needed for people on STEM tracks, and doesn't form a knowledge base the majority of our citizens will end up employing in their professions.

So no, there is no such thing as "base information on math and science" that forms a "base knowledge for every profession." There is a humanistic / liberal arts base knowledge of critical thinking, reading and writing, needed for constructive citizenship in a democracy, and then there's having the self-discipline and flexibility necessary to learn a new discipline or master a new content area when needed, which it's projected we'll need to be more able to do as the number of people able to make a living by staying in the same stable career throughout their working lives grows smaller, as most forecasters predict it will.

We don't live in anything resembling a "global society," whatever that may be. Even as our trade with other countries increases, local knowledge, local conditions, and local cultures persist. A teacher is someone who is fully educated themselves, knows how to assess the educational level of students and make intelligent decisions about how to help them progress in the content areas to the greatest extent possible during the time allocated for her to spend directing their learning. Much of her success in the endeavor will depend on her ability to engage their INTEREST, which has little to do with whether or not she is following the directives of a Common Core mandated from on high, and her ability to engage INTEREST can be destroyed by rigid mandates that certain topics or content be covered in a prescribed manner and in a certain time period and / or by the need to "teach to" standardized tests. If she is fully educated herself and understands child development and sound methods in the content areas, she does not need corporate / federal / state-level direction, and she certainly doesn't need "scripts" that mandate what she says to students, which some debased educational programs are actually introducing into classrooms at this point. All of these programs -- Common Core, standardized testing, scripted learning, etc., ad nauseam are associated with a massive and inappropriate condescension to and disrespect for K-12 educators, a distrust of their judgment, a notion that those who teach children are in some sense children themselves in need of direction from higher level authorities, and a desire to control them and the children under their care.

It's true that you won't get people who are fully educated and who understand child development and pedagogical methods without having the kind of professional standards the state of Arizona is now trying to abolish, and you won't maintain them in your classrooms without paying them a professional wage appropriate to the investment they've made in their own college and master's level education and to the ongoing requirements to maintain credentialing. But it's also true that you won't get them by turning a profession which had allowed creativity and individual discretion appropriate to fully educated professionals into a profession only fit for mindless automatons.

17 likes, 1 dislike
Posted by Yes to credentialing standards, no to Common Core. on 01/13/2017 at 2:31 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

It is amazing how many things are mistakenly labeled as racist, and then how racism is actually missed by those same people.

Inept? How many abandoned Obama because he was inept?

Does it set you off when somebody imitates Ricky Ricardo?

10 likes, 46 dislikes
Posted by The Russians Hacked My Email Again on 01/13/2017 at 2:20 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

But Wrong, Again...No- YOU do NOT get it! was calling you a racist bigot.

That is the truth which is common knowledge for those who actually have common sense.

I understand that you don't understand this because common sense is the lost ark as far as you're concerned.

42 likes, 12 dislikes
Posted by AZ/DC! on 01/13/2017 at 2:13 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

No, YOU do not get it.

FU for calling people racist bigots.

'Progressives' offer no value. Their entire agenda is to undermine and not respect the Constitution of the United States of America. You're communists and won't even admit it. And now you have been totally repudiated at both the state and federal level.

16 likes, 60 dislikes
Posted by What, Again on 01/13/2017 at 2:04 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

Wrong, Again...as usual.

Raul Grijalva was born in the USA.

Your racism blinds you from facts.

Dying slowly...although the pace is increasing with each nasty, racist and ill informed post.

53 likes, 18 dislikes
Posted by AZ/DC! on 01/13/2017 at 2:02 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

No, YOU do not get it.

The comments made earlier do have racial bias interjected into them. Just because there is one drunken, rotten apple among the elected progressives does not negate the value of the issues which we support. We, unlike most right (gotta be right all the time) wingers is that we can fess up and say that someone who is allegedly progressive is not serving the community. It will be sometime before most of the die in the wool "Trumpies" abandon him for being inept. He will do nothing for the lower and middle class of this nation. He will make it easier for the rich to get richer on the backs of the working class.

Raul always has a driver. One of his enablers.

12 likes, 30 dislikes
Posted by No- YOU do NOT get it! on 01/13/2017 at 1:58 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

" The millions who did not vote because they blame both parties deserve respect."-huh? You were elected by voters to represent the non voters and get them some respect? Respect is way over rated when it is doled out like accepting full responsibility for something. As in Janet Reno and the Branch Davidian deaths. It meant nothing.

Nancy Pelosi said Wednesday that when the ACA is repealed that those poor people would no longer be productive members of society, because they lost their preventative care.

Nancy, they have a $10,000 deductible! That prevents them from going to the doctor. And the skyrocketing rates are keeping the REAL rate payers from eating.

Take you socialist progressive ideas back to the country where you saw them working successfully and join them.

The voters have spoken.

21 likes, 51 dislikes
Posted by Allen S on 01/13/2017 at 1:49 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

So basically all the posters are correct? This is not about racism except by him and his progressive racist roots.

Apparently we don't "all get it." Progressives will allow anybody to advance their cause as long as theirs is also hidden in their amongst it.

Do you know if he is driving drunk?

21 likes, 57 dislikes
Posted by The Russians Hacked My Email Again on 01/13/2017 at 1:40 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

It is no surprise that Trumpites would talk smack about Grijalva and add enough comments for us all to recognize that they are racist bigots. We know their roots and we know what to expect. OK we all get it.

What I think is being lost on many in Tucson is the amount of disgust that Grijalva has accumulated within the Mexican voting community. I live, work and socialize mostly on the beautiful west and southwest side of Tucson. For about a year and a half I have repeatedly heard criticism about Grijalva. Here is a short list:
The lack of responsiveness from his office. It is extremely slow or non-existent;
Raul Grijalvas continuous display of drunkenness in public. He falls all over himself; stammers and basically embarrasses himself;
His constant interference into Tucson Unified School District politics based on his daughters lack of skill and ability to do the job on her own. She would be a big zero without his political support;
His exploitation of progressive issues. He knows that those of us who are progressives cannot much argue with his voting record. However, for him this is a no brainer. He supports every progressive issue and knows that it is going to go down in flames in the current Congress. He hardly has to work but he still accrues points; and
His is so-called machine, which may be losing some its steam. (Many of Rauls candidates lost on November 8th, including one who he practically raised: Cam Juarez
It is time to oust Raul and replace him with someone outside of his incestuous camp. The Grijalva machine is not serving the community, inclusive of the Mexican community. He has not delivered much of anything to improve Tucson or to positively impact the working class of Tucson.
Raul has become the worst of politicians. His alcoholism impedes him both physically and mentally and he relies on all of his enablers to help him get by. Getting by just is not good enough.
(A short list of his enablers: Mona Grijalva, Adelita Grijalva, Glenn Miller, Regina Romero and Mr. Regina Romero, Richard Elias, Ramon Valodez, Dan Eckstrom, Jonathon Rothschild, all Tucson Weekly writers, the Pima County Democratic Party, HT Sanchez, Kristel Foster, Cam Juarez, Isabel Garcia, etc.)

29 likes, 41 dislikes
Posted by Disgust Grijalva Has Accumulated in Mexican Community on 01/13/2017 at 1:32 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

Oh no. Tell me it's not true. Raul the fool won't be there. They better keep all guns and sharp objects away from Trump. What does this self-important putz think Trump is going to do, beg him? What a brass pair.

24 likes, 64 dislikes
Posted by CW13 on 01/13/2017 at 1:28 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

Mexico? I tot he was kuban.

14 likes, 64 dislikes
Posted by The Russians Hacked My Email Again on 01/13/2017 at 1:17 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

Of course he won't. He hates America. He's so crushed he won't have any power to actively destroy it anymore.

And his 'constituents' in Mexico should welcome him back to his home country.

27 likes, 71 dislikes
Posted by What, Again on 01/13/2017 at 1:00 PM

Re: “Ducey 'Next Step' Watch: Day 237—Talk Is Cheap Edition. Ducey's Funding-Lite, Destructive Education Proposals.

The only problem, there, "yes, no," is that these were standards, not straight jackets. And do opponents believe there should not be base information on math and science that should be universally known regardless of location? After all these ARE the base knowledge for every profession. The question I kept asking was should there be regional standards for math knowledge, biology and geology, computer science, English grammar, in a global society. The irony is that the same critics who whined about US students not competing with students in other countries then did not want universal, international standards "straitjacketed" on our students.

23 likes, 12 dislikes
Posted by Frances Perkins on 01/13/2017 at 12:51 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

Oh my gosh. Donald will be heartbroken if this racist gaspacho is a no show. If he could drop the hatred long enough to listen to them he would have heard the ACA is not being repealed without a replacement coming on board.

Try giving some respect. You might get some.

You and Sen McCain could get together to plot against our citizens.

28 likes, 71 dislikes
Posted by Dan Hyde on 01/13/2017 at 12:03 PM

Re: “U.S. Rep. Grijalva Won't Be Attending the Trump Inauguration

A Phony uses a phony excuse to disrespect the new President. I've said it before and I'll say it again, Raul is a jerk. A grade-A, can't be topped jerk.

38 likes, 73 dislikes
Posted by Mac on 01/13/2017 at 11:55 AM

Re: “Ducey 'Next Step' Watch: Day 237—Talk Is Cheap Edition. Ducey's Funding-Lite, Destructive Education Proposals.

I was with you, Frances, until you started pitching for Common Core.

Fully educated, fully professionalized teachers -- the kind we should continue recruiting to staff our classrooms -- do not need (and most I know do not want) a rigid straight jacket tying them to regulators' vision of what is appropriate to teach to every same-age cohort of kids in the United States.

Ever heard of Vygotsky's zone of proximal development? You determine where a particular cohort is and gear instruction to meet that cohort where they are, taking them from point A to point B or from point B to point C. Leaping from point A to point Z is impossible and expecting it is abusive of both the teachers and the students in question. But it is exactly those kinds of leaps that are prescribed by rigid, top down, uniform standards like Common Core that are developed at a considerable distance from those on whom they will be imposed and do not acknowledge real and important differences between cohorts living in radically different circumstances throughout the US.

Children are not widgets, and their learning cannot be manufactured according to specifications determined by authorities with no direct knowledge of the characteristics of the groups in question.

"..the larger and more authoritarian an organization, the better the chance that its top decision-makers will be operating in purely imaginative worlds." Kenneth Boulding

17 likes, 3 dislikes
Posted by Yes to credentialing standards, no to Common Core. on 01/13/2017 at 10:43 AM

Re: “Ducey 'Next Step' Watch: Day 237—Talk Is Cheap Edition. Ducey's Funding-Lite, Destructive Education Proposals.

You should allow a place for high achievers who will be competing in the global race. After all, they will be the ones subsidizing those who are not able to achieve.

60% of Households Now Receive More in Subsidized Income Than they Pay in Taxes - REDISTRIBUTION OF INCOME!
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-11-18/6…

And everyone balked at "47%". Try 80% dependent on 20%. Do you really think that a country can achieve anything at that point?

Teacher training? They need to take a Non Violent Physical Intervention class so that a teacher knows how to handle "Special Behavioral Problem" students when she is attacked! I had such training and after retirement went back to Substitute. As a SUB (because of this training), I was required to "follow" ONE student all day long to keep him from attacking other students and teachers while holding onto my hair and scalp! Education has been reduced to this a dumping ground for parents who didn't particularly want kids but needed the deduction!

3 likes, 31 dislikes
Posted by Postimpressionist on 01/13/2017 at 10:31 AM

Re: “Ducey 'Next Step' Watch: Day 237—Talk Is Cheap Edition. Ducey's Funding-Lite, Destructive Education Proposals.

We have a shortage of doctors in rural areas of the State. Let's just relax regulations on doctors or allow Cochise or Mohave Counties to just write their own regulations on doctors. This will solve the shortage problem. Right, Kelli Ward? It's similar to those who hated Common Core standards. When they were asked to specify which standard was most in error, of course none of them had ever read the damn things. So Arizona changes a couple of minor standards, slaps a new label on them and magically, Arizona Standards, none of those pointy headed standards from Obama. Works the same with doctors. What could go wrong.

25 likes, 13 dislikes
Posted by Frances Perkins on 01/13/2017 at 10:24 AM

Re: “Ducey 'Next Step' Watch: Day 235 — State of the State Edition. Great Ideas! Terrific Ideas! Wallet Still Safely Stowed in Back Pocket.

That Ms. Putnam-Hidalgo and Stegeman -- both strong critics of the three person majority that was in place in TUSD 2012-2016 -- want to attribute Pedicone's resignation to the results of the 2012 election that put this majority in place is not a surprise.

For the record:

Pedicone's contract extension was signed in August of 2012. The election that changed the TUSD Board majority to Grijalva-Foster-Juarez occurred in early November 2012 and Foster and Juarez assumed office in January of 2013. Pedicone's resignation letter was dated March 20, 2013, more than four months after the results of the election were clear.

The Star article on the resignation stated, "Pedicones resignation from Tucsons largest K-12 school district [...] is effective at the end of June more than one year before his contract is set to expire. The announcement, made Wednesday at Tucson Unified School District headquarters, came as a surprise to many as Pedicone has repeatedly voiced his commitment to TUSD despite its many challenges."
http://tucson.com/news/local/education/precollegiate/pedicone-resigns-tusd-to-launch-immediate-search-for-new-leader/article_c1e50118-9188-11e2-ac5c-0019bb2963f4.html

The public statements made about the resignation, including the resignation letter

http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/tucson.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/1/d2/1d262a68-9191-11e2-a919-001a4bcf887a/514a089f4ceb2.pdf.pdf

do not make clear what specifically motivated the resignation, which is common in statements of this kind. Nothing in the letter and nothing in the timeline leading to the resignation determines that the resignation was necessarily a reaction to the change in the governing board majority.

A lot can happen in four and a half months. I see no reason to disqualify the assertions that have been made by more than one person close to top-level TUSD decision makers -- assertions made independently of one another, on separate occasions, and with no knowledge of what the other parties making the same assertion had said -- that the largest factor in Pedicone's resignation decision was Stegeman's behavior between August of 2012 and March of 2013.

In closing, it's worth noting that there is at least one factual error in Ms. Putnam-Hidalgo's post. She states, "Pedicone[...] saw a compliant board quickly flip to one that was, at least during the campaign, completely opposed to his major contributions to TUSD-- [including] school closures...A few years into the new Supe... those same candidates were [...] allowing school closures to proceed."

It was not years after coming on the Board and after the Sanchez administration was in place that the new members (Foster and Juarez) reversed their positions on school closings. It was immediately after they came on the Board, before Pedicone's resignation. The Board voted for the closings in December 2012, immediately before they joined, the desegregation authority approved the closings in February 2013, immediately after they joined, and the new majority made no move to stop or revise the closings asked for by Pedicone's administration and approved by the previous Board and the desegregation authority. The closings occurred between the 2012-2013 school year and the 2013-2014 school year, just as Pedicone stepped out of the Superintendency and as Sanchez assumed the role.
http://tucson.com/news/local/education/precollegiate/us-judge-gives-tusd-go-ahead-to-close-schools-cites/article_6a8a16dc-6476-51a3-8923-1a4676a8fed4.html

It may be true that the PCDP operation has demonized Stegeman, but it is unfortunately also true that others, in opposing PCDP's view, have been led to view him in a more positive light than a careful examination of his behaviors in office would suggest is deserved. Those who've watched the district's recent history without a revisionist impulse and wishful thinking coloring their judgments know that it will be important to keep a very close eye on what Stegeman does with his role, going forward.

9 likes, 1 dislike
Posted by For the Record: Pedicone & the 2012 Board Transition on 01/13/2017 at 10:20 AM

Re: “Ducey 'Next Step' Watch: Day 237—Talk Is Cheap Edition. Ducey's Funding-Lite, Destructive Education Proposals.

...and certification makes an attempt to complete an in depth training to prepare teachers for harsh realities?

Spoken like a true union member and/or educational elitists. Nobody else could possibly be smart enough to handle the rigors of daily life.

3 likes, 31 dislikes
Posted by TUSD should be ashamed on 01/13/2017 at 9:48 AM

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