I wouldn't trust anything the Salvation Army says or does, until they publicly take responsibliity for injuring and nearly killing a 6 yr old little boy. Besides I've heard that they love to stock pile items donated and their people pick over items before they get distributed. When they are willing to be open and truthful, perhaps more people will be open with their pocketbooks.
Most competent politicians keep up with the daily political views and bills, Guess she really is not concerned as we see most Republicans, as they just vote NAY each time. So they don't have to keep up or have any knowledge of bills
Her comments show us that Republicans and the Tea Party really don't understand how to be a law makers, They are not prepared for making decisions and key votes. Currently they vote NAY on everything. But voters continue to elect them to office. But these are voters that don't care or incompetent
If I were interviewing Ms. McSally for an executive position in my company, I would ask her questions that would help me to determine whether she had taken the time to get to know our company and marketplace. Great leadership/management candidates are the people who have done their research and have taken the time to understand our challenges & opportunities. Philosophy is nice, but it doesn't let me know that someone has the knowledge and skill set to lead the company.
As a private citizen with no interest in a political office, I know where to find legislation and have a short list of people I can contact if I need more information on policy or legislative information. I take the time to stay informed -- not just as a voter, but in case I need to advocate for my work, family, etc.. To imply that this process is too complicated to handle outside of an elected office is absurd. More disturbing still to hear a political candidate imply that they just don't have the time to inform themselves as a private citizen.
This article just cost Ms. McSally one vote.
I remember back last campaign she NEVER had a platform...this time is the same deal. Martha has one talking point, the A-10 which isn't even a major concern to over 3/4 of the voters in the district. I've watched since last campaign and have yet to see where McSally has DONE anything other than take hikes in the Catalinas with her dog and now we're supposed to vote for her simply because? Unless McSally makes a HUGE turn around I seriously cannot fathom why anyone would vote for her.
I am a mother to a young daughter and a member of an ELCA church. I was forwarded this article from a friend and am truly shocked. I have always been proud to be a member of the ELCA but am very disappointed in the leader of this church. This type of information--hiring a registered sex offender into a leadership position--needs to be shared with the entire congregation. It is up to them whether or not they remain a member of this church and whether or not they choose to interact with this individual. By hiding it the way the church did shows there was something wrong with the situation.
I am also shocked and incredibly disturbed at some of the comments made. Throwing out citations on recidivism (or his ability as a musician) is completely ignoring the feelings and experiences that these young women had as victims. Have some compassion! It may be that this man never rapes another child again... but that isn't the point. The point is that he DID do this and ruined the lives of many people.
I looked up the story and he was a teacher that molested at least two girls. One article I read said "he thought they were 16." That was his defense. It's sick. He used his power and authority to manipulate them and the entire community. Whatever the church decides to do, I as a parent would never let my daughter near this person and would question anyone that trusts him around young women.
If Martha wants to represent me and the district I live in she ought to make some time to find out what's going on in Washington. It's not like the bills that have been put forth are top secret and there certainly haven't been more than a dozen that represent actual legislation, especially from the House.
If she can't find time to do that now, without all of the distractions of DC, how will she ever have time if elected to office?
Interfaith Community Services, which runs its own food bank at 2820 W. Ina Road, began its holiday food bag distribution on Monday and it runs through next Wednesday. The bags have all the ingredients for needy families to prepare a traditional Thanksgiving meal, but ICS could still use donations of frozen hams and turkeys. They're going through 50-100 of them a day.
Fred; I saw some passing comments about Barber's voting record, but never with the kind of vitriol he exercise toward Republicans. I have met Jim while a student at U of A, he is a nice man but does not have an unbiased bone in his body. He lives and breathes the liberal agenda and anyone who dares disagree with him are subject to serious scorn. If he would try to understand the other view points rather than ridicule them, he may see there is some reason and logic to the sides. I try to do that and take great umbrage when I see a wrong.
I think they should tell the partyers to shut it down twice....
Two times of asking one to keep it down and the third time is the letter.
That is FAIR and would go UNCONTESTED. The way it is now it looks as though the red tag people are LAZY but..... They should also know that EVERYONE is becoming very CAMERA SAVVY and whenever the person/s does NOT ask at least ONCE for the party to shut down (Prior to giving the red sticker) they will be in BIOG TROUBLE and will be sharing the burden and taking their Department down with them!
Two-time losers have a pretty lousy track record here in southern Arizona: Jesse Kelly, Jonathan Paton, Ben Buehler-Garcia, Rick Grinnell. Refusing to take positions on legislation solidifies McSally's place on this list.
There's going to be a frybread sale in Old Pascua to help raise money for the Tucson Indian Center's Thanksgiving boxes on Saturday, 11/23/13 from 10am to noon at Pascua Center 785 W. Sahuaro. All money raised is going to the Tucson Indian Center.
to nam687Ovet: Perhaps you should spend more time reading what is published here. I have seen a number of articles here discussing Barber's penchant for trying to attract right wing voters in his area by supporting GOP/TeaParty nonsense.
I find it difficult to believe anyone who would state how they would vote for legislation they haven't read. Oh wait, isn't that what Pelosi told the Democrats when the ACA came up for a vote? The questions should be what do you believe in not what-ifs. I would imagine a great number of Democrats in the district would be upset over Barber's votes supporting the Republican stance on a wide range of topics that would normally rile the Democrats. Why isn't that being covered? Oh yeah, Nintzel only knows how to gripe about Republicans.
Is she at it again? Tell this LOSER to stay home this time.
If a convicted drunk driver is drinking again after driving to a bar, is it not helpful to alert the public? There's no proof that he's actually planning to get back in a car. If a convicted killer or mentally unstable person is caught stocking up on weapons, should people not be alerted, even if there is no proof he's planning to use them? If a convicted arsonist was playing with gasoline and matches outside your home, wouldn't you like to know, even if you can't prove he was going to set your house on fire?
If a convicted sex offender and obvious con-man was caught lying to an entire community, and covering up his past, then why should that community not be informed about the truth?
The facts here are pretty straightforward.
Mr. Holtan admitted to having sex with multiple teenage students, while he was in a position of authority as their teacher. In the process, he repeatedly lied to the entire community about who is was and what he was doing.
He was convicted of the crimes, and served a couple years in jail, for essentially being a con-man who used lies and his position of authority to get sex from young girls.
Now, we know for a fact that he is again lying to an entire community, in an attempt to cover up his past crimes.
He has told people within a church that he did not go to jail for his crimes. He downplayed his crimes as minor "inappropriate relationships" for which he was only given probation.
In fact, it gets worse, while looking into this story, I've discovered Mr. Holtan was actually interviewed by the AZ Republic a few years ago (Tucson 'leader' a convicted sex offender, 1/30/08). You have to be a subscriber to view the article, but in it, he actually denied that he had sex with anyone underage. He claimed he was punished for touching the shoulders of his victims, and on top of it all, it HE PROCLAIMED HIMSELF TO BE THE VICTIM. Again, this is all despite admitting to police that he in fact had repeatedly had sex with multiple underage students!
This clearly is the same story he has been telling to members of this church. And just as he was, for years, able to convince people in Minnesota that he was a great guy who had their daughter's best interests at heart, all while raping several of them, he has again been able to convince members of this Tucson church community he is a great guy, who has been wronged in the past, and has nothing but their best interests at heart. He's done such a good job of covering up his past, that he actually got the church to ignore their own stated policies when it comes to sex offenders.
No, there is no proof that he has taken the next step and actually molested more young girls, but there is plenty of proof that he doesn't feel his actions in the past were wrong, and has no problems lying to cover them up. If that doesn't make him a danger, and if informing the public about that danger is not "constructive" what would be?
I am not in any way shape or form affiliated with SNAP, in fact I have been harshly critical of some of their other actions and behaviors. To the best of my knowledge, I have never met Mr. Holtan. I have never been abused myself. But I can see when there is EVIL in the world, I have seen the impact that EVIL can have on people for the rest of their lives. I find it frightening when people think the best way to deal with EVIL is to cover it up, pretend it doesn't exist, and hide behind generic studies that ignore the facts of a specific case.
What would be your constructive suggestions be for how this is handled then? Through silence. Keeping the women and girls silent because it is easier for Tucson and, in your opinion, easier for them to not relive the past.
Surprising that there are not studies regarding what happens if nothing is done and these offenders are allowed to get away with their crimes with nobody speaking up. Those studies you site reveal the likelihood of these crimes happening again... No matter what. That is why people deserve to know the past and it might be the only defense to prevent this happening again. Joelle's purpose was only to educate and enlighten.
I realize for the vast majority of us that go through life without these terrible pasts, it is easier and better for is to go through life with rose colored glasses thinking these kind of crimes don't occur and people are mainly harmless. But for the people that are forever changed because of another persons reckless and terrible actions, they can't turn a blind eye in fear it would happen to someone else. You would realize this if you looked at it with a human empathetic point of view and not try to rationalize SNAPs work through scientific research.
OK, one more time: It's great if SNAP wants to do something to prevent repeat offenders - without having ANY evidence that the person in question here has. WHAT SNAP IS DOING IS NOT HELPING. It's not helping the Tucson community and it's not helping stop sex crimes.
From my earlier post, which isn't something I made up but has been confirmed by studies, something no one from SNAP has done to back up its claims:
- Sex offender registration, sex offender notification and increased prison sentences have not shown to be effective in reducing recidivism.
- Studies show that comparing sex offenders sentenced to prison versus community sentences, the recidivism rate was 7% higher for prisoners compared to those offenders kept in the community. Additionally, longer prison terms also increased risk upon release.
- Studies show that registration and notification have little impact on stopping offending
When sex offenders are driven underground (without supervision) because of harsh penalties, they are considerably more dangerous.
- When offenders are connected to their communities, when they are allowed to work and are intensely involved with a therapeutic community, recidivism was significantly reduced.
- Even though punishment makes communities, legislatures, and many in the media feel vindicated, that response is not always shared by victims.
Nothing that anyone from SNAP has commented here shows that SNAP has any done anything but aggravate the situation. Not just in Tucson, but anywhere. All you guys are saying is that you've been victimized and/or how awful sex crimes are. That doesn't help anyone and it sounds like you might even be hurting yourselves.
If you want to do something about sex crimes, do something constructive.
I went to the high school in Duluth during the time "Mr. Holtan" was the "wonderful" choir instructor that everyone "loved" and he did indeed do amazing things with the choir program. On the surface he portrayed a talented charismatic choir teacher while he took the innocence and forever changed the lives of friends, sister, and daughters in our community... Forever.
He did this for years because nobody would have thought somebody with his reputation could do this and because his multiple victims were manipulated into remaining silent and not talk about what was happening. A matter of fact it didn't come to light until years later when communication and information was finally shared.
Joelle's so called tactics of "fear mongering" are the only way this can be prevented by happening to other peoples friends, sisters, and daughters. And "forgiveness" can only happen AFTER the truth comes out. If people in Tucson believe that "Mr Holtan" was only put on probation then he is lying to this congregation and manipulating them. If he and the congregation are keeping this information and afraid of you knowing this information, what else are they hiding?
I also recommend people read Joelle's blog titled "Worthy Adversary" regarding her purpose and visit. I am NOT affiliated with SNAP and didn't know about Joelle until I read this article. But I have seen how this has changed the community I grew up in and firsthand the people it has effected. Their lives have forever changed long after Eric Holtan's probation is over, but I can guarantee everyone wants to move forward. That can only happen, though, if there is certainty that the past won't repeat itself with someone else's sister or daughter or friend.
I plead guilty to being fearful. I fear for the safety of Tucson kids around Holtan. I fear that if Dove church officials hid Holtan's past from their flock, what else might they be hiding? I fear that other employers will take similarly deceptive and risky and hurtful moves like putting convicted child molesters around children, thinking "Well, if Dove got by with it, I probably will too."
David Clohessy, Director, SNAP, Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests, (7234 Arsenal Street, St. Louis MO 63143), 314 566 9790 cell (SNAPclohessy@aol.com)
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